±«Óãtv

Cameron talking about slavery and grilling, laughable

Fractional reserve banking amounts to debt slavery and it seems no banker has a need for grilling

Oh dear

wonder why not

anyone up for grilling a banker ?

"The chief cause of poverty is people out of work" wounder why that is ? anything to do with bankers doing 'gods work' with 'special needs' ? Anything to do with a feudal hierarchy imposed by a class system which includes who your parents are, education (university education now well out of reach of the working class) where you live (also see education) how you speak (best not be Liverpool or Birmingham)

Errr sorry Mr Cameron poverty is far more than people out of work. Its a planned state to have people remain in debt slavery via fractional reserve banking - Usury .

Spending cuts amounts to bankers privatising profit and socialising their galactic loss.

"lack of control" Mr Cameron talks of the past Govt - fair enough what about galactic lack of control of bankers right now. All boned up with credit default swaps ready for the next titanic; oil blow out; bank blow up event.
How about that Mr Cameron come lets here about the trillions of $ on derivative betting and naked short selling. How about we hear about the bond bubble soon to be burst.

Last night, Mr Paxman asked the rhetorical question 'who cares' with respect to the Pope's visit. What I find remarkable is that nobody asks why the ±«Óãtv has permitted so much attention to be given to this matter of Catholic clergy and alleged child abuse with no investigation of other religious or social-bonding leaders. That is the unacceptable bias.

The timing of the lifting of the excommunication of those who strongly objected to the reconciliation brought about by Vatican II in the 60s (Society of St. Pius X (SSPX)), and the fuss which this led to because of other political and no doubt financial associations at the time, surely is no coincidence? That's why it is, I suggest, naive to ask "who cares?". Although, given the heat which it all generates, is it best played down? Is that not how deregulation ran amok to all our cost in terms of loss of public services and welfare state? In whose interests might that be other than retailers, speculators and financial service providers? It's a dilemma. Who does God's work? Is it the Pope, or is it Wall Street investment bankers and their colleagues in the USA government these days? You decide.



See the political positions adopted to appreciate why there may be a fuss.

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#2

Christianity is historically the European religion so no wonder it's widely discussed i'n the British media. Regarding the Pope's visit, apparently there's much less interest i'n it than was the case with John Paul II.

@ Tabblenabble #2 - people do NOT approve of the fact that it will cost taxpayers £20million to fund his visit. Heads of State get funding from taxpayers, why should the Pope?

It is not bias to show that children have been abused in the Catholic Church and that it was covered up.
Even Sinead O'Connor calls for the Catholic hierarchy to resign


Remember Britian is still a predominantly PROTESTANT country, with the Queen as the Head of the Church. Britian is NOT a Catholic country, and the Pope's teachings contradict modern life in issues such as abortion, contraception, being gay/lesbian, celibacy, ordination of women etc......if the Pope was still as relevant or popular today, then why have there been so many unsold tickets to see the Pope?

A quote:

Like it or not, we now live in a new age of "One World." This is the
age of global companies, of global communications and transport, of
global food supply and finance and...just around the corner...global
accommodation of political systems. In this sense, there are no home
markets, no isolated markets and no markets outside the global network. It is time to face the fact that true national sovereignty no longer exists. We live in a world of big business, big lawyers, big bankers, even bigger moneymen and big politicians. It is the world of "The Secret Team."
In such a world, the Secret Team is a dominant power. It is neither
military nor police. It is covert, and the best (or worst) of both. It gets the job done whether it has political authorization and direction, or not. It is independent. It is lawless.

Colonel Fletcher Prouty

#6

Fletcher, the shopkeeper of the no longer running ±«Óãtv sitcom, due to the death of the actor?
Apologies, but I've forgotten the names of both.

Well Well Well take note everyone -



How long do you think it will take before Geithner smells a rat and gets on the blower to Osborne.

#7

I remember now, the sitcom was called 'Open All Hours' and the name of the wonderful actor was, if I remember correctly, Kenneth Baker.

mim

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NN wrote:

"The government will be making its major announcement on the Spending Review in a month's time. Michael Crick is in Manchester for us tonight and we hope to bring together representatives from various public sectors and government to debate the impending cuts to public sector spending."

I rather like this poster's comments on the situation…

/blogs/thereporters/robertpeston/2010/09/how_will_public_sector_cuts_af.html

AND GLOBAL MADNESS (#6)

The mind of man is not configured to having NO family, NO territory, NO culture and NO (sustainable)identity. We just can't do global - we can't even do EU.

More and more of the 7 billion are 'going mad to stay sane' (Andy White - worth a read.)

5. At 1:26pm on 15 Sep 2010, Mistress76uk wrote:

Wrong. You just don't appear to understand. The Pope is a Head of State and that is why it is a State Visit. That many people believe something does not make it true. It is not even how democracy works!

Look into the religious background of many of those who are signing their pointless petition. Largely self-centred media junkies, just look at some of their peculiar reasoning to see what I mean. It's classic psychopathology..




"It is not bias to show that children have been abused in the Catholic Church and that it was covered up."

It is bias not to report it elsewhere with the same weight. You don't see this do you? Why not?

"the Pope's teachings contradict modern life in issues such as abortion, contraception, being gay/lesbian, celibacy, ordination of women etc"

And some say that these 'modern life' values are precisely why we are now suffering population decline and increases in crime, obesity, martial breakdown, STDs, dumbing down, economic woes, loss of community life and public services etc. Some refer to that as demographic warfare.
Or can you not grasp that? You describe modern life but don't grasp it. Is that not just a little short-sighted? What accounts for that do you think?


6. At 1:47pm on 15 Sep 2010, kevseywevsey wrote:about the CIA.

"In Prouty's own words, from the 1997 edition of The Secret Team:

"This is the fundamental game of the Secret Team. They have this power because they control secrecy and secret intelligence and because they have the ability to take advantage of the most modern communications system in the world, of global transportation systems, of quantities of weapons of all kinds, and when needed, the full support of a world-wide U.S. military supporting base structure. They can use the finest intelligence system in the world, and most importantly, they have been able to operate under the canopy of an assumed, ever-present enemy called "Communism." It will be interesting to see what "enemy" develops in the years ahead. It appears that "UFO's and Aliens" are being primed to fulfill that role for the future. To top all of this, there is the fact that the CIA, itself, has assumed the right to generate and direct secret operations. " [L. Fletcher Prouty, Alexandria, VA 1997]"



That would turn out to be the likes of The Leeds-Bradford Not So Secret Team? So this chap was air airborne cab driver and message boy?

Seriously, what matters and will always matter is consumers vs people.
Those who sell stuff need consumers, and want to get the most out of those 'saps' with least outlay, so, the less regulation there is to protect consumers ('saps') from 'sharp-salespersons' out for promotion, the better, some think - and of course, others will think exactly the opposite. So the battle goes on and on and on.


"7. At 2:59pm on 15 Sep 2010, mimpromptu wrote:
#6

Fletcher, the shopkeeper of the no longer running ±«Óãtv sitcom"

No. Your associations (references) are too loose. Fletcher was a prisoner played by Ronnie Barker in Porridge (he sparred with Richard Beckinsale, the father of Kate). It was Richard who died young. The above reference is to someone quite different, all you had to do was look it up!

1. At 12:36pm on 15 Sep 2010, flicks2 wrote:

"The chief cause of poverty is people out of work" wounder why that is ?"

You ask another question. Some time back, the OECD suggested it was due to falling skill levels and labour being cheaper abroad. Why might skill levels be falling here? How might that come about based on first principles? I suggest you don't continue your analyses far enough to get to the root of the problem.

There you go, we have now successfully made this nation look like a Third World country. So, is it really any surprise that investors will choose larger, even less regulated, Third Word countries than this is becoming in order to get their labour and consumers? Still, watch us compete! :-(

/news/uk-11317441

Still most here won't see this because they're so limited. Point out this limitation to them and they'll shriek that they are being 'insulted', even though it's true. Now who behaves like that, and who dares never say it to them as a consequence? No wonder they go nuts in middle age.

Shame on you Andrew Neil for not picking up on the importance of this :-



Going on about some pub stuff on the Daily Politics and all the relative irrelevance (people trafficking aside) on PMQ's

#14

I would have looked it up if I hadn't been out i'n Queensway. I did get it wrong the second time as well but I'm sure I remember perfectly well Kenneth Baker talking about the wrong 'snow' when he was the Interior Minister, as well as that one cannot be i'n 16 places at same time, referring to a large screen displaying 16 squares.

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Blue sky i'n the morning.
Blue sky i'n the evening.
I'm wondering how many people are this moment singing.
And how many people are playing the piano, the trumpet or the violin.
The very thought does make my heart happy.
Signfed - mim

I'm looking at simply an amazing tree
It does have other colours and not only green.

mim

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Silence of The Carrots/can you hear my carrots SCREAM

I Can, Vegans Take Note, Keep your hands off CarRot

"All wealth derives from the private sector, the state simply spends some of it."

Another good aswer to a complete fallacy...

/blogs/thereporters/robertpeston/2010/09/how_will_public_sector_cuts_af.html

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So that's where the 3rd world remark came from......


Well he should have taken the Pope back to Italy with him!:p

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I am not a Catholic...in fact, I'm an athiest.

But the comments from a certain poster on here, about a concerted smear campaign against the Pope and Catholicism in general...judging by most of the meedia output over the last 72 hours, would appear to be completely true.

18. At 6:26pm on 15 Sep 2010, mimpromptu wrote:
#14

I would have looked it up if I hadn't been out i'n Queensway. I did get it wrong the second time as well but I'm sure I remember perfectly well Kenneth Baker talking about the wrong 'snow' when he was the Interior Minister"

I'm not complaining about you getting things wrong per se (we all do that, i.e. we're all fallible). I'm drawing attention to the process itself and suggesting that it would do you an awful lot of good to practice a lot more self-criticism (and to thank others for sending some criticism your way too).

Ken Baker was Environment Minister, Education Minister (famous for the National Curriculum on his watch) and ±«Óãtv Secretary (aka Interior Minister in some countries, and was famous for getting prosecuted for contempt of court). I'm not sure that you are right about the 'wrong snow' remark, but as I say, there's no harm in your questioning and looking it up. Just don't be too sure that all that you imagine is in fact true, as one is very often wrong. Much that you think is almost definitely false, and I suggest you'd be a far happier person if you found that out, and how and why you make so many mistakes.



Mimpromptu, many of your posts above are of the error sort. They are loose associations and off-topic. Try to focus more.

Perhaps this is a common female thing? Males tend not to let other males get away with such behaviour, especially not in accountable engineering etc jobs as they'd fear the offender might leave screws etc out etc.
Imagine pilots, doctors etc doing this Mimpromptu. Be warned, ±«Óãtv Production Teams and journalists are doing it more and more these days.
See Pope and Paedophilia etc and omission of the important stuff viz troublesome priests, Vatican II and 'Satan' etc.

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I am not a Catholic...in fact, I'm an athiest.
Me 2 so why should my tax money pay for a papal visit that I do not support.

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38. At 10:26pm on 15 Sep 2010, Janthebishop wrote:

Me 2 so why should my tax money pay for a papal visit that I do not support.

----------------------------------

Because the Vatican City is considered a state.

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#40 Because the Vatican City is considered a state.

So this is a state visit, by the head of state and NOT the head of the Catholic church, and who by the way supported the priests who were/are abusing children. I will never ever support such a man

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we are to starve the BFI of funds, films that pay for themselves five times over after the war in cash strapped Britain we produced such gems as Passport to Pimlico, Hue and Cry, The Third Man, The Importance of being Ernest, Man in the White Suite, The Ladykillers etc., and also the NHS, the nationalisation the railways, the steel industry and the roads. It was an age of some of the greatest strides in our history and we were ten times worse off than what we are today and now we are condidering slashing health budgets, slashing police numbers and not proceeding with the schools programme....daft I call it!

#42

'So this is a state visit, by the head of state and NOT the head of the Catholic church, and who by the way supported the priests who were/are abusing children. I will never ever support such a man'

But do your homework and don't just shoot from the hip. The incidence of child abuse in the Catholic faith is actually less than in society in general.

Why not is the same interest taken in child abuse in say...the Jewish or Muslim religions?

I think there may be vested, subversive, intersests at play here that simply want to undermine the Catholic/Christian religions.

Who might you think would wnat to do that?

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#45 But do your homework and don't just shoot from the hip. The incidence of child abuse in the Catholic faith is actually less than in society in general.

Why not is the same interest taken in child abuse in say...the Jewish or Muslim religions?

Shooting from the hip you say that's condesending of you may I suggest you do your homework....when this hmm man was just a bishop he signed certain papers that absolved said priests, how do i know this well i do happen to read, as for the other religions you are probably right but until people bring me proof i will not judge

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#48 the answere/aware 2 that is u dont have a head
headless spring chickenly springs 2 mind

hmmm well i want some of those pills you have been taking....

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"47. At 11:26pm on 15 Sep 2010, Janthebishop wrote:

"Shooting from the hip you say that's condesending of you may I suggest you do your homework....when this hmm man was just a bishop he signed certain papers that absolved said priests, how do i know this well i do happen to read, as for the other religions you are probably right but until people bring me proof i will not judge"

But you have judged, you just don't see that you have irrationally judged.

Furthermore, you imply that you have only read what has been presented to you, but that is precisely how propaganda is peddled is it not? It certainly isn't how rational analysis is done, by anyone. You say you have read, but you appear to have missed that there have been frequent remarks in the press since this first broke to the effect that the frequency in the Catholic clergy is probably lower than in general society.

Why do you respond to benevolent efforts to educate you as instances of condescension? Do you think we are all equals? A lot of people do these days, but isn't that just irrational narcissism? How could everyone be equal? How could there ever be any education if that were so?

Well Dun Auntie/±«Óãtv Team this morn

The Mains O Fintry right on Q,close 2 my home close 2 my Heart

±«Óãtv is where The Heart Is

The W.I. Magic

Can I Marry The 5 Lovely Ladies

I Promise not 2 Cause any Trouble

well maybe, I cant Promise

52 Keep Pointing Your Bayonet Away from Me

over 2 you Jan, Am I hiding behind A Woman

I Might Be,A Nice Place 2 hide

#52 But you have judged, you just don't see that you have irrationally judged.

Furthermore, you imply that you have only read what has been presented to you, but that is precisely how propaganda is peddled is it not? It certainly isn't how rational analysis is done, by anyone. You say you have read, but you appear to have missed that there have been frequent remarks in the press since this first broke to the effect that the frequency in the Catholic clergy is probably lower than in general society.

Why do you respond to benevolent efforts to educate you as instances of condescension? Do you think we are all equals? A lot of people do these days, but isn't that just irrational narcissism? How could everyone be equal? How could there ever be any education if that were so?



No I have not judged anyone the Courts and the Justice System did that...

As for Equals I believe that we all come into this World the same way and we will all go out of this world the same way that to me makes us Equal, what we do inbetween is called LIFE and we have to accept the conseqences of that said life.

52 is jan gunning for you

EQUAL we all come in2 this world equal and we leave equal therfor we are Equal Cancel that out.

Judge Everone HAS 2 Judge

Crossin A Road I have 2 judge can I get across the road or do I turn myself in 2 strawberry jam on the TarMac thanks 2 that car, i can judge that

Duck and Dive Stay Alive

you asked not to be called 'mad', 'duke' and i'm happy to oblige even if it's not entirely clear whether you are, in fact, addressing mysel. how about insane, though??? you don't find offensive, do you??

#57 correction

on reflection, perhaps I should have used the word 'barmy' and it does have 'puby' connotations

you went to some pub yesterday, didn't you, and apparently it was not the 'Anglesea Arms' was it the 'Duke of Cambridge' then?

@ Tabblenable #52 - you keep going on about how other faiths may have cases of child abuse....so why don't you give us examples from each faith then? Or is it the case that it is HUGELY widespread in the Catholic Church, unlike other branches of Christianity or other faiths?

Just got A Letter from Postie

From The R.N.L.I./The Royal National Lifeboat Institution

They Save Lives not for Profit but for Life, Maybe your/my Life

26 quid 2 become A Member I'm up for that, more if I Can

58 No that shut years ago

Spoilsports, that would be politicians

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"No I have not judged anyone the Courts and the Justice System did that..."

No, you made a judgement, and you are just unaware of how you have done so. When the modus operandi is pointed out to you, like many, you reject it as you are not aware of what you have done, or how you have done it.

When you go to the doctor and he or she tells you what is wrong with you, do you argue because you didn't know what was wrong with you? More and more people these days appear to have major problems with their private behaviours (psychological states). Why is this? Might there be something radically wrong with our education system, and society in general? What might the name for that be?


"Sex abuse statistics
Protestant denominations that allow clergy to marry have similar sex abuse statistics as Catholics; insurance companies that cover churches in case of claims for sexual abuse charge the Catholic Church no higher premiums than any other religion. The Catholic Church produces no more sex abusers than any other organisation."

Irish Medical Times May 2010



Biased sampling by the media is a classic topic used by psychologists to illustrate the irrationality of human judgement. If one does not judge one assumes the Null Hypothesis and then goes and collects data (samples)from representative populations in an effort to reject that Null Hypothesis (which assumes that all groups are equal). How many journalists or readers here have bothered to do any of that? How may resent being told to do that? How many resent being urged to be rational? Is there a sex difference? How many have looked to see if all groups are equal in cognitive ability in the upper part of the ability distribution which attracts researchers? Why are there individual and group differences? What might produce individual and group differences (like height etc)?

Questions questions.

59. At 10:26am on 16 Sep 2010, Mistress76uk wrote:
@ Tabblenable #52 - you keep going on about how other faiths may have cases of child abuse....so why don't you give us examples from each faith then? Or is it the case that it is HUGELY widespread in the Catholic Church, unlike other branches of Christianity or other faiths?

Thank you Mistress .....We will eagerly await the reply he should give us

Cuts

given

..In The Use of Knowledge in Society (1945), Hayek argued that the price mechanism serves to share and synchronize local and personal knowledge, allowing society's members to achieve diverse, complicated ends through a principle of spontaneous self-organization. He used the term catallaxy to describe a "self-organizing system of voluntary co-operation."

In Hayek's view, the central role of the state should be to maintain the rule of law, with as little arbitrary intervention as possible...



we can see Cameron is just continuing Hayek Thatcherism and The Big Society is just a popular term for hayek's catallaxy.

Given

..Hayek claimed that: The past instability of the market economy is the consequence of the exclusion of the most important regulator of the market mechanism, money, from itself being regulated by the market process.

which is a market fundamentalism that resulted in the credit crunch. Those who say the credit crunch is the failure of capitalism miss that its just the failure of the market fundamentalist Hayekism that believes the market has perfect knowledge and so is the best arranger of all affairs.

So the tory cuts is based upon more thatcherite hayekism that the State [or anyone else] knows nothing and the market knows everything.

This is another idol that clearly demands human sacrifice [cuts, debt,etc] on a massive scale?

"59. At 10:26am on 16 Sep 2010, Mistress76uk wrote:
@ Tabblenable #52 - you keep going on about how other faiths may have cases of child abuse....so why don't you give us examples from each faith then?"

Because in order to reduce the frequency of people like your behaving irrationally (and it really is a daily occurrence, believe me), people such as yourself (and you are one of many) have to go and actively do some work to correct this irrational behaviour yourself, not me. Do you understand?

#61

No no no, The Duke of Cambridge is going very strong - been there, seen it. The people working there have always been very friendly with me and the pub has a lovely decor, with lovely lamps and paintings on the walls. It's in Battersea, York Road. Like the Anglesea Arms it also has a terrace in front.

Misguided imagination has taken a duck in the wrong direction
Poor thing is lost, swimming and diving here and there,
Believing it’s in control everywhere.

mim

@ # 66 - See you are baseless in your arguments, hence the failure to cite any cases at all!

Rev Ian Paisleyhas gone to protest the arrival of the Pope in Edinburgh
/news/uk-northern-ireland-11326555

#69

It's a legitimate visit, though. It may be questionable how the Pope's travel and stay are being financed, especially i'n the current economic climate and the pressure that the Catholic Church will be put under while the Pope is here might, i'n the long run, help it clean up the questionable ethics that has been 'practised' by so many sexual offenders amongst the priests and the way it's been dealt with by the religious authorities.

I do think that the Catholic priests should be allowed to marry and that anticontraceptive 'gear' should be legitimised.

mim

"As for Equals I believe that we all come into this World the same way and we will all go out of this world the same way that to me makes us Equal,"

That's vacuous - it just says what is obviously true, i.e that we are all born and that we all die. That we all must face the consequences of our actions is also essentially vacuous. as what matters is how and why we tend to subtly differ on that score. To appreciate that requires one to do some diligent research, as we are demonstrably not all equals on that score any more tan we are in height and strength. Please learn some behavioural science, and I do mean behavioural. It would also help if you looked more carefully at the structure of what you say and believe as it is very easy to delude oneself that one believes something worth knowing when really it is just he first step towards thinking about what really matters.

If we were all equals we would all get A*s in everything (not just most people, but everyone).

69. At 12:13pm on 16 Sep 2010, Mistress76uk wrote:
@ # 66 - See you are baseless in your arguments, hence the failure to cite any cases at all!"

Did you go and look for yourself as instructed? It appears not.
That's evidence of how irrational you are. That failing is critically related to your celebrity worshipping too. Can you work out how?

As a related question: do you know the difference between evidence and argument? Argument is vacuous by itself (look into this), and in your case it is clearly delusory because you don't understand the difference between validity and truth. That's true you know.

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