Windows on Your World
Blogmeister Marc tells me MORE Windows on Your World pictures have been added to the last gallery. A reminder that we need them ALL in by Jan 24. Or I may have said 25. I can't remember. Certainly we can't do anything after Burns' Night, on account of being hungover for a week. We aim to get them all posted by the end of the month. THEN we'll deal with the people we've let down.
Talking of which, the newsletter, which returned for a triumphant day, remains broken. Negotiations are underway.
In the absence of the facility to send subscribers an email - here's what we're planning for tonight.
1: Should a TV show which thrives on publicity keep getting it?
2: Should politicians really get upset about a TV show that needs publicity?
3: Do politicians need publicity?
4: Should Channel 4 be shut down?
5: Should everyone at Channel 4 be put down?
6: Should anyone be surprised that viewing figures for the hugely controversial and shocking show are up by about a million?
7: Should we be doing more on this?
8: No, really?
9: Is there anything else going on in the world?
10: (time permitting) ±«Óătv Office disarray, people on trial for conspiracy to murder, German attempts to make Holocaust denial an EU-wide offence, snow being airlifted to the alps, people fleeing Lebanon, Israeli politics in flux, and an increase in treasure. Oh and something about Big Brother. And perhaps about how the comment link doesn't work.
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The ±«Óătv should not be wasting time and space on the death-throes of a programme screened by a rival TV company.
How's that?
NO. COME ON Chrissie (1) I need MUCH more anger than that. COME ON!
quite agree Chrissie. Wasn't it bad enough having to listen to all that guff about D & V B* last week withouth having now to listen to guff about a program that presumably milions DON'T watch. Eddie - we don't care, we're not interested, we don't give tuppence. I know we've complimented PM before on being a bit more magazine than say the 6 o' clock news but that doesn't mean that we want the radio equivalent of Hello magazine.
PLease major on some of the items in 10 and leave 1-9 alone.
Whayhay! A newsletterblogthreadthingy.
I would ignore the bad behaviour (ie the programme!)
I'd make a strong play for Number 5 on your list, Eddie.
That would make us all sit up and listen!
BB should have been axed when they released Gorgeous George back into the community. Respect.
Well, the viewing figures went down when the dreaded Goodys (nb nothing to do with excellent ±«Óătv TV children's series) arrived, but the 'racism' row may be just the thing for it.
Let's hope it's a very busy afternoon so Eric and team have to drop any item they're planning.
PM should outstrip Big Brother and lead the world in being the first radio programme to insert a wine bottle into a vital orifice.
(Q) What was Elvis's last great hit?
(A) The bathroom floor!
My SO was so incensed at the ubiquity of BB on C4 that he counted up how much of the schedule it occupies.
8 hours a day, over the weekend! Tell me, how does this fulfil C4's Public Service Broadcasting requirement?
Please PLEASE don't waste airtime on this. Do all the other stuff. Do news, current affairs, climate change, end of the world.
Anything but 'that'!
Fifi (being unusually serious for once)
Let's go with the snow. That sounds like far more fun. Perhaps we should have a Piste as well as a Beach....
Ah, Burns Night. Can't wait. Islay malts and lots of Haggis. Eddie, you shouldn't have mentioned it, I'm unable to concentrate on my very important work.
Down with reality TV, Up with ±«Óătv PM. I am also allowing people of ±«Óătv PM [Staff and Froggers] to read my latest blog.
I'm sorry, I'm not with you. Has the new series of ER upset that many people?
Oh, I see... Come on -- hands up who is surprised that a few really thick people who are desparate to be famous (despite the fact that this will expose their metal deficiencies) are also racist in that "I'm so dim I don't even realise I'm being racist" way? No Hands? Thought not...
Address to a Haggis.
Fair fa' your honest, sonsie face,
Great chieftain o the puddin'-race!
Aboon them a' ye tak your place,
Painch, tripe, or thairm:
Weel are ye wordy of a grace
As lang's my arm.
The groaning trencher there ye fill,
Your hurdies like a distant hill,
Your pin wad help to mend a mill
In time o need,
While thro your pores the dews distil
Like amber bead.
His knife see rustic Labour dight,
An cut you up wi ready slight,
Trenching your gushing entrails bright,
Like onie ditch;
And then, O what a glorious sight,
Warm-reekin, rich!
Then, horn for horn, they stretch an strive:
Deil tak the hindmost, on they drive,
Till a' their weel-swall'd kytes belyve
Are bent like drums;
The auld Guidman, maist like to rive,
'Bethankit' hums.
Is there that owre his French ragout,
Or olio that wad staw a sow,
Or fricassee wad mak her spew
Wi perfect sconner,
Looks down wi sneering, scornfu view
On sic a dinner?
Poor devil! see him owre his trash,
As feckless as a wither'd rash,
His spindle shank a guid whip-lash,
His nieve a nit:
Thro bloody flood or field to dash,
O how unfit!
But mark the Rustic, haggis-fed,
The trembling earth resounds his tread,
Clap in his walie nieve a blade,
He'll make it whissle;
An legs an arms, an heads will sned,
Like taps o thrissle.
Ye Pow'rs, wha mak mankind your care,
And dish them out their bill o fare,
Auld Scotland wants nae skinking ware
That jaups in luggies:
But, if ye wish her gratefu prayer,
Gie her a Haggis!
With best wishes to all the Scots around here for Burns Night.
Does anyone know what it means?
Si.
Yipee - finally made it!!
Rather wish it was a more profound comment on life, the universe etc. etc, but hey ho that's what it was all about.
Thank you Marc with a c.
1: Should a TV show which thrives on publicity keep getting it? No. So don't cover the issue on your programme. Channel 4 and related media are making a meal out of this to counter their flagging ratings. Nothing more.
2: Should politicians really get upset about a TV show that needs publicity? I would hope that they would be more upset about all the killings which have occurred as a result of their ineffectiveness to stop an illegal invasion. But maybe that's just me.
3: Do politicians need publicity? Not in this manner, no.
4: Should Channel 4 be shut down? Yes.
5: Should everyone at Channel 4 be put down? Yes.
6: Should anyone be surprised that viewing figures for the hugely controversial and shocking show are up by about a million? No. See above. It isn't news that Jade Goody has a big mouth and no brain.
7: Should we be doing more on this? Absolutely not. Do far far less. In fact, do nothing about it. I beg you.
8: No, really? Yes, really.
9: Is there anything else going on in the world? Just a few million things. Do an update on polytunnel planning permissions if you must, but please do not cover this waste of space or time.
I can't understand why MP's are upset about people on 'Reality shows' like Big Brother making daft, ill-informed comments. I think their expectations of that type of programming is way too high.
If they want to see intelligent people on the Television they should watch University Challenge and the such like.
If they want to hear well-informed comment, they should listen to Radio 4.
Eddie
I refuse to answer any questions other than your Nos. 1 & 7 and the answers are NO and NO.
although not directly related to surveillance I think its ok to talk about and the creeping of 'terrorist-style' laws extended to criminals through the Civil courts which require a lower standard of proof.
This is actually very important!
oh.... ah, sorry..... I now see you're talking about criminally poor programming...
I'll get me coat
Does anybody have a good cure for hangovers that they can forward to Eddie?
After all, it's only 8 days to Burns Night, so Friday week's programme could be rather unusual if we don't lend a helping hand.
To whom it may concern:
The frogger known as Big Sister hereby wishes it to be understood that she is in no way related to the transmission known as Big Brother. Neither does she have shares in said enterprise, or in any other way have any link whatsoever with it.
Anyone who tries to construe such a link will be referred to her legal experts, Messrs. Flywheel Shyster and Flywheel.
I agree with the comments so far. As far as I can see from the news clips, this is either a cynical attempt to boost ratings or simply a bunch of chavettes slagging off someone with the temerity to have a bit of class. Either way it's hardly news.
I was, however, unnerved by a comment on the ±«Óătv "Have Your Say" forum about this talking about the attitude of "the Goodies". Fortunately I realised that Bill, Graeme and Tim have much more sense than to get involved.
Now that I think about it though, the episode where the Goodies' house is encased in concrete for decades gives me an idea...
Absolutely, I'm with the 2 comments above. (aa & Chrissie). I've never watched Big Brother & if my luck holds I never will. So the witterings of a bunch of tr*ll*ps with nary a brain cell to share between them is of no interest to me. As this is the first afternoon for ages I'm free to listen to PM, please don't fill it with that sort of padding. Start at No 10 on your list & work onwards.
But as a more important matter of interest, do we know whether Lissa, Nik & Mr Knibbs have made their epic voyage north yet, & how did it go if so? Did he break out of the cat, sorry, dog cage? Lissa, if you're out there - we need news! Proper interesting news, not that nonsense Eddie is trying to feed us via the programme tonight.
Hear, hear. I'd rather hear about the newsletter and the Frog than about a TV programme that is non-news (and which I have never seen).
If you really want to discuss 1-9, please leave them to the end of the programme, the bit I rarely hear!
Eddie with two 'i's,
Can you also include a bit about Blog moderation? After all, we may as well go for broke today .....
I agree too, Chrissie and Annie. Lets ask the Editor to think about something else to Broadcast without a mention of any television programme on the Beeb, ITV, or chanels 4 and 5.
Thank you for the ''newsletter'', Eddie. Please do not give the aforementioned show any more publicity....we listen to PM to get away from dross like that. Even my teenagers know better than to even mention it to me, so surely you should know better.
I vote for News as opposed to Gossip.
No messages anywhere since shortly after 1pm - are we suffering from a bloggage somewhere in the system?
Is it still today or has tomorrow come? It's very dark in here isn't it?
Wonder what will happen if I press this butto
What on earth is going on today? Nothing here for hours, likewise nothing at the Beach or in the Furrowed Brow.
I get the feeling nobody bothers about us any more.
And where are my fellow froggers hiding?
Bit of a slow appearance day today isn't it???
I'm more intrigued about the snow being airlifted to the alps!
Oh! Well, I posted a comment here over an hour ago. PM has just started. Hmmm
I think this is important. The evidence for what is, at best, cultural ignorance is overwhelming. Does this not raise questions about the racial attitudes of many people in the uk. Radio 4 has a duty to raise questions about these issues and if they centre on a hugely popular programme that millions of ordinary people watch on a regular basis then all the better.
I'm just listening to Eddie discussing Channel 4's Celebrity Big Brothers latest antics.
I have only caught snippets of the programme itself, and get the distinct impression that these so called celebrities involved are quite possibly behaving in a racist manor, as racists are almost certainly ignorant. However, I get the distinct impression that this is more to do with jealousy, as Shilpa is far more attractive, intelligent, well educated and confident than these small minded young nobodies.
In the past I have scoffed at friends who watch BB, but somehow I found myself glued to it this season. I was pretty outraged by the emerging gang racism (reminded me of the Lawrence 5 on the secret ±«Óătv filming minus a discussion on which weapons to use). I was more angry however at Endemol for putting up subtitles when Shilpa Shetty was speaking when there was no real need for them since she was perfectly audible. I didn't call C4 or ring OfCom however, since I fully expected C4/Endemol to find a way to resolve the problem (eg by bringing in some new housemates), but I'm glad to hear that others did and that there is enough racism awareness out there to create a bit of a fuss.
I'm happy though that PM didn't give it too much time (for all the reasons stated) although a pity you gave a bandwagon jumping politician the time to waffle on about it (though you had a good go at him, Eddie!) rather than getting in the programme makers...
Apart from going to a recording of the News Quiz tomorrow night, my life really is quite dull so I'll be watching BB again with interest to see how the white trash redeem themselves, if that is possible...
I can't purport to be an expert because the only bits of CBB I have caught have been when I've switched on for other programmes I did want to watch, but I would say that Shilpa has been rather unpleasant most of the time in the house. It is just a shame that the other housemates are not bright enough to find a way to address this in terms other than those which are plainly racist.
Some of the housemates comments have definitely contained elements of racism, and the comment about not knowing where Shilpa's hands had been was apalling, but all of this is within a context of bullying. Bullying is a permenant feature of Big Brother, & one which is encouraged, particularly in the 'civilian' version because it makes for exciting viewing?!
Shilpa is easily scapegoated because her 'difference' is easily identifiable, & this is an unpalatable aspect of group dynamics, which I am sure the programme relies on. It is no real surprise that the show's orignal psychologist left due to ethical concerns.
I do think it is funny that the housemates have underestimated Shilpa's stardom, it is a bit like bringing Sienna Miller in (not A list but nearly!), and while they will be lambasted for their racist behaviour it looks like the tabloids have taken Shilpa's side. Others will exit to a very uncomfortable interview with Davina, while Shilpa's dream of appealing to a world outside Bollywood will likely come true, which is presumably why she is on the programme in the first place.
Sara, less despondency please, we have Burns Night to look forward to which is at my house this year, all froggers welcome to The Bier. I trust Ed will give you the origins of my house name!
Having just now, by email invited the PM team to Burns Night at mine (I don't know what came over me!) I am all of a twitter imagining Eddie in a kilt. What do you wear under yours Eddie? Mary, we might need more than scented candles!
Anne P - your knitting is famous at last! What a lovely warming fire! I hope he appreciated the jumper?
PS - are you sure you're not also masquerading as
Well, as it appears that that a lot of the threads are blocked up, I may as well choose here to make some comments likely to be unpopular with regular froggers.
I thought tonight's PM was pretty appalling. I just can’t understand why so much time was taken up with BB. And as for inviting Peter Hain on to specifically talk about BB and then have a pretty severe pop at him for not concentrating on all the other things that politicians should worry about – well, hardly up to the usual standard Eddie.
I think Peter Hain should have turned the question round and asked if PM didn’t have better things to discuss during the 60 minutes.
RJD - I switched off after 15 minutes (Sorry Eddie).
Belinda - To be fair, I missed the start and end of the programme, because of other things. Usually that would annoy me, but not tonight.
Why is everyone so surprised? Only the middle class media and politicos can believe that the lower orders really like people who are different.
Those of us who live and work in the real world know that in every situation difference is often feared or despised. If the programme is showing racism then those watching will either agree (and therefore probably not listen to your programme) or see it for what it is and not want to hear you give it even more publicity. Iincluding news about news does nothing for your programme or any paper that cares to print an article about it
What I'm starting to find irritating during PM are the constant trailers for other programmes on Radio 4, & all the "contact us" details which are read out in vox pop style voices during the programmes. Is it all a cunning plan to reduce the amount of "live" content on the programme, & presumably also the cost? Frankly, I think we listen in to hear your voice Eddie, (not that I'd want you to get big -headed or anything)doing interviews, or a report from Chris, Nigel or even Marc if he's ever unchained from his desk these days. If you subtract all the promotional stuff, and the headlines & the weather, just how much of an actual programme are we getting each day? Is this cost-cutting by stealth ? And if it is, Idon't think it's very stealthy!
Helen at 39! What have you been drinking, smoking or something?
Mary
Annasee - I suspect all the 'vox pop' voices are all ex-PM presenters, although I have only been able to identify Joan Bakewell and the unmistakeable Valerie Singleton. I thought it was a pretty novel way of airing the “contact” information at the beginning but I must admit it is beginning to grate after all these weeks.
As for trailing other programmes, this seems to be spreading across all radio and TV. I don’t mind things being trailed between programmes but not during them. ±«Óătv news is forever doing a piece about the next Panorama.
You’d think I didn’t like PM – but I do. I was just really hacked off with it tonight!
I'm reposting the following here, as I didn't notice this thread whilst listening to the programme and scratching a living as a Legal Aid Lawyer. The post is amended as I realised that in my anger I rushed the original and it didn't quite read correctly.
Vera Baird QC just said on PM that she pays solicitors by the hour and not by the case. That's just untrue for criminal solicitors. We do get paid by the hour for police stations - I did 5 hours yesterday for the grand sum of ÂŁ260 (which includes costs for overheads etc). If/when they introduce a fixed fee I will get less than that for the five hours.
For Magistrates Court Cases and relatively easy cases in the Crown Court we get paid by the case and not by the hour. In the magistrates court a few cases which involve a great deal of work will be paid by the hour. The rates will vary between about ÂŁ28 and ÂŁ60 (private lawyers can charge upwards from about ÂŁ150 per hour).
And what has she just said about "quality will be improved"? How, we have to take on so much more work to make the same money. The government
I wish Eddie had interviewed her. His style would have been perfect.
Mary
Because it's now predictable ,almost to the minute,when the breaks will come,I'm sure a lot of drivers pace themselves by the programme.
Unfortunately,I'm sure lots of people are quite happy with the change,
Molly
Because it's now predictable ,almost to the minute,when the breaks will come,I'm sure a lot of drivers pace themselves by the programme.
Unfortunately,I'm sure lots of people are quite happy with the change,
Molly
I vote for number 5 with one addition. Anyone who watches Big Brother should be put down or at least stopped from having children ;-).
Perhaps Labour could do this by introducing a Darwin act aimed at removing people who watch reality shows from the gene pool? Now that would give Blair the legacy he wants so bad.
1: Should a TV show which thrives on publicity keep getting it?
It
2: Should politicians really get upset about a TV show that needs publicity?
Yes if it contains racism.
3: Do politicians need publicity?
Yes
4: Should Channel 4 be shut down?
No, don’t be bl**dy silly Eddie!
5: Should everyone at Channel 4 be put down?
Only the people who produce BB in all guises.
6: Should anyone be surprised that viewing figures for the hugely controversial and shocking show are up by about a million?
Duh!
7: Should we be doing more on this?
No.
8: No, really?
Yes really, I mean No.
9: Is there anything else going on in the world?
Oh probably not, but would still prefer you to describe paint drying, if this is the alternative.
10: (time permitting) ±«Óătv Office disarray, people on trial for conspiracy to murder, German attempts to make Holocaust denial an EU-wide offence, snow being airlifted to the alps, people fleeing Lebanon, Israeli politics in flux, and an increase in treasure. Oh and something about Big Brother. And perhaps about how the comment link doesn't work.
Just the trivia then.
I missed the first half hour of the programme this evening due to struggling with telephone call centre and yet more promises that it would be fixed by tomorrow. But if I deduce correctly that time was spent on BB, then I can only add my voice to those above - WHY?
I don't watch it, I never have, I never will. And if racist, bullying behaviour is pulling in the audiences then it's clear it's just more bread and circuses.
GM (40) the jumper isn't finished yet, still the sleeves to go. What with Christmas and everything it's only been worked on during PM for the last few weeks. The real question is will I run out of yarn before I get to the end?
Gavin (8) ROFL.
RJD (42) Re: I thought tonight's PM was pretty appalling. I just can’t understand why so much time was taken up with BB. And as for inviting Peter Hain on to specifically talk about BB and then have a pretty severe pop at him for not concentrating on all the other things that politicians should worry about – well, hardly up to the usual standard Eddie. I concur -- most unlike our Eddie and it fair made me squirm.
Funnily enough Annasee I was thinking along the same lines myself only yesterday when listening to the program and wondering if the whole thing would be axed when the day came that the trailers and the contact details - which seem to go on forever - took up more of the hour than the news and interviews.
I also think we get the news headlines far too often, but I appreciate that is done for people who are joining hte program at different times, as they leave work, get home etc.
Thank you for exposing the synthetic nature of Peter Hain's outrage, as it became evident that he didn't actually know what had happened on the BB programme - the coverage was worth it for that alone.
As for criticising him for talking about BB when that's what you'd asked him to do, well, I thought you made it clear he'd already spent a large slice of the day doing that.
Pity - he's one I usually have a bit more time for than the Blairite apparatchiki.
annasee (23)
When you wrote tr*ll*ps, did you mean prostitutes?
David, something has led me to believe you are 'Vyle Hernia'. Am I right?
PUSH - Grrr!
Please don't waste any more time on BB
No, I am not "David". You'd be unlikely to catch me writing such profundities.
While I'm at it, I agree with many comments above, especially about the trailers coming during programmes. 4 sets of headlines do get a bit much when one hears the whole programme (I nearly did yesterday).
Must see if I still have a tape recording of the Private Eye Christmas record c1970, which contained a spoof edition of the PM programme ("and now here's John with the latest - time!").
The only other pseudonym I have used was, "Inquisitor veri." (seeker after the truth)
Hello Vyle (again, an odd thing to type, but I digress). It was something David said on his own blog -- clearly you have been plagerised! (Oh well, OK, not quite...) Apologies for doubting your singularity -- I'm quite pleased really: I've long had a suspicion about your name in anagram form -- shared by at least one other frogger I find (the suspicion, not the name).
Gosh I'm extra blethery today! I'm off!
And as for my grammar and spelling today -- I can only apologise: No excuse would make up for it. Oh the shame...
Well my 1.56pm post (currently at 64) doesn't make much sense without the one before it. Grrr.
Appy
Are you having a bad day? Look, it's Friday - just leave it and head to The Beach.
Not at all RJD, I am having a very good day and have just come home quite squiffy! Guess who is on TV too?!?! (Clue -- Friday night project on Channel 4).
Ap - Didn't see it or him but you should see the photographs in tonight's Belfast Telegraph!
Re 69: Who/what is in them? Is it you?
Ap - No. It's Mr Nesbitt as an Angel. I've seen nicer things!
Well, I was so intrigued I Googled the Belfast Telegraph but couldn't find said piccie :-(
Ap - I'll send it to you!
I'll hold you to that!
Scan and email OK?
Fine and dandy!